Understanding the concept of Core Values is something that makes me feel uneasy. I used to think people and their actions are simply good or bad. But what if thede actions could be ranked differently in the context of particular system of values and that system may not be same for all. I lately spend much thinking whether the core values that we used to consider universal (truth, goodness and beauty, by Aristotle) are really universal for all humanity. Could it be that some cultures simply do not acknowledge these three as core? Not just individual people, but entire cultures or even civilizations. I don’t have a definite answer to this, but during my travels I may have collected more and more evidence to believe that Truth, in particular, is not something commonly valued and respected in all corners of humanity. I also observe that many people, even educated, question the existence of universal truth.
Thanks Paul, fascinating read. Would it be safe to say that western humans value wants more than needs, perhaps because most needs are met most of the time?
Thanks John. In general, I think that is right, but it is also a side effect of Captialism that certain needs get sacrificed for others. For example, how community and family needs get sacrificed for material needs.
Part of maturation (prefrontal cortex) is the assimilation of your own world view - including morals, social norms, goals, and such like. It is not so much learned but decided upon. Developing your own “personal” micro-philosophy is ideal for this part of neurodevelopment.
I disagree with the comments that suggest (other) animals are merely automatons without any capacity for making novel choices. Our species, since before the advent of writing, lived as part of nature. As we changed from small band hunter-gatherers to farmers 15-20,000 years ago (or so), we made ourselves insecure (see my initial post for an in-depth explanation) and as a result have needed to make ourselves more special than all other forms of life. In so doing, we have tried to claim we are not animals, that we are utterly uniquel instead. But, for example, research shows that all mammals have the same range of emotions. While we may have more higher cortical functions than most, there is clear evidence of the intelligence and learning capacity of whales, dolphins, elephants; also with some species of birds. Proof of that is the fact that the same species of whales that live in different pods and in different areas have different languages and different (learned) hunting techniques.
Thanks for this comment, I am sure it will lead to some good conversation.
I don't take myself to view animals at automatons. I believe that they are living things capable of certain kinds of actions (and feelings). I also don't take myself to believe that they cannot make novel choices.
I do think that non-human animals are not agents in the same way that human beings are. That is to say, even if they have preferences (maybe for one kind of food over another), they are not able to deliberate and decide on the basis of normative reasons.
My view of human animal relations is that we are very close to non-human animals, and we have a lot in common with them, but what distinguishes us from them is that we have the capacity for judgment and self-creation.
Looking forward to hearing more about what you think.
For some reason, not all of your comment is included above. Nonetheless, I remain in disagreement. As for deliberating, watch a cat deciding how and where to jump. Granted, most other animals do not use words, but many do communicate with each other in a variety of nuanced ways. I studied the process philosophy of Alfred North Whitehead. His cosmology reveals certain basic universal trends, including the pattern of evolution from the simple to the complex. As I mentioned before, the fact that the same species of whales can have groups that are geographically and behaviorally different for their language and hunting practices, which are learned by the young with the aid of the adults, show that judgements and reasoning varies. If it were all programmed, there would be no differences.
David, thanks again for a thoughtful reply. Let me try one more time and see what you think. I take the important difference that I am trying to get at to be illustrated by the following fact: an animal cannot choose to commit suicide, but a human being can. Does that help at all?
Hi David. I agree, many animals are likely to have sentience. Humans are though unique in having part of the brain that deals with values that informs most of what we do or interpret in the world. Even other primates lack this incorporated brain function.
Your point about modern humans lacking something our ancestors have, I couldn’t agree more.
Yes David. Specific area that is absent in all other animals is the frontopolar cortex, but most animals lack the lateral prefrontal cortex. Indeed, most animals have very little prefrontal cortex. Bear in mind though, that the most stark differences are in connectivity.
Prefrontal cortex is responsible for higher thought - reasoning, morals, planning complex tasks, empathy, theory of mind, etc…. The frontopolar cortex is an extension to the prefrontal cortex. Magic happens there that we don’t fully appreciate as yet.
Understanding the concept of Core Values is something that makes me feel uneasy. I used to think people and their actions are simply good or bad. But what if thede actions could be ranked differently in the context of particular system of values and that system may not be same for all. I lately spend much thinking whether the core values that we used to consider universal (truth, goodness and beauty, by Aristotle) are really universal for all humanity. Could it be that some cultures simply do not acknowledge these three as core? Not just individual people, but entire cultures or even civilizations. I don’t have a definite answer to this, but during my travels I may have collected more and more evidence to believe that Truth, in particular, is not something commonly valued and respected in all corners of humanity. I also observe that many people, even educated, question the existence of universal truth.
Thanks Paul, fascinating read. Would it be safe to say that western humans value wants more than needs, perhaps because most needs are met most of the time?
Thanks John. In general, I think that is right, but it is also a side effect of Captialism that certain needs get sacrificed for others. For example, how community and family needs get sacrificed for material needs.
Love the idea of micro-philosophy. Fits with the neuroscience.
Dan, you are the first person who has made this connection. I would love to her more about how you think the two fit together.
Part of maturation (prefrontal cortex) is the assimilation of your own world view - including morals, social norms, goals, and such like. It is not so much learned but decided upon. Developing your own “personal” micro-philosophy is ideal for this part of neurodevelopment.
Thanks Dan.
I would like to learn more about the connections between the brain and morality. Do you have any reading recommendations?
I disagree with the comments that suggest (other) animals are merely automatons without any capacity for making novel choices. Our species, since before the advent of writing, lived as part of nature. As we changed from small band hunter-gatherers to farmers 15-20,000 years ago (or so), we made ourselves insecure (see my initial post for an in-depth explanation) and as a result have needed to make ourselves more special than all other forms of life. In so doing, we have tried to claim we are not animals, that we are utterly uniquel instead. But, for example, research shows that all mammals have the same range of emotions. While we may have more higher cortical functions than most, there is clear evidence of the intelligence and learning capacity of whales, dolphins, elephants; also with some species of birds. Proof of that is the fact that the same species of whales that live in different pods and in different areas have different languages and different (learned) hunting techniques.
Hi David,
Thanks for this comment, I am sure it will lead to some good conversation.
I don't take myself to view animals at automatons. I believe that they are living things capable of certain kinds of actions (and feelings). I also don't take myself to believe that they cannot make novel choices.
I do think that non-human animals are not agents in the same way that human beings are. That is to say, even if they have preferences (maybe for one kind of food over another), they are not able to deliberate and decide on the basis of normative reasons.
My view of human animal relations is that we are very close to non-human animals, and we have a lot in common with them, but what distinguishes us from them is that we have the capacity for judgment and self-creation.
Looking forward to hearing more about what you think.
-Paul
For some reason, not all of your comment is included above. Nonetheless, I remain in disagreement. As for deliberating, watch a cat deciding how and where to jump. Granted, most other animals do not use words, but many do communicate with each other in a variety of nuanced ways. I studied the process philosophy of Alfred North Whitehead. His cosmology reveals certain basic universal trends, including the pattern of evolution from the simple to the complex. As I mentioned before, the fact that the same species of whales can have groups that are geographically and behaviorally different for their language and hunting practices, which are learned by the young with the aid of the adults, show that judgements and reasoning varies. If it were all programmed, there would be no differences.
David, thanks again for a thoughtful reply. Let me try one more time and see what you think. I take the important difference that I am trying to get at to be illustrated by the following fact: an animal cannot choose to commit suicide, but a human being can. Does that help at all?
Hi David. I agree, many animals are likely to have sentience. Humans are though unique in having part of the brain that deals with values that informs most of what we do or interpret in the world. Even other primates lack this incorporated brain function.
Your point about modern humans lacking something our ancestors have, I couldn’t agree more.
What part of the brain is this?
Yes David. Specific area that is absent in all other animals is the frontopolar cortex, but most animals lack the lateral prefrontal cortex. Indeed, most animals have very little prefrontal cortex. Bear in mind though, that the most stark differences are in connectivity.
What is the frontipolar cortex responsible for? And also what about prefrontal cortex?
Prefrontal cortex is responsible for higher thought - reasoning, morals, planning complex tasks, empathy, theory of mind, etc…. The frontopolar cortex is an extension to the prefrontal cortex. Magic happens there that we don’t fully appreciate as yet.